What caused this?

[party_music50]

My old elegans came up a little later than usual and definitely doesn't look right this year. I'm wondering if root competition from a nearby pine tree would be causing it?

This is what it looked like yesterday. The leaf color and shape is all wrong and it's extra weird (but pretty) with the rippling! And it is definitely elegans. It's been in that spot for at least 15 or 20 years.


I divided it several years ago, and here's a photo of that division (also taken yesterday):


What do you think is causing the odd appearance? We've had two really dry summers (for us) and they're both growing in sheltered/dry locations but I've tried to give them ample water, as well as the trees that grow around them. They both got plenty of nice compost last year, and both were mulched with green woodchips (in autumn) from an ash tree that got busted in a storm last June. The color of the 1st elegans makes me think of nitrogen deficiency, but doubt if that could be it because everything around it is growing great this year.

[Chris_W]

I think there is another hosta in there with Elegans. Could be seedlings that have grown up, but I see Elegans back there too (I think).

[party_music50]

OMG, Chris! I never grew any hostas near this one, and I always deadheaded it *except* for one year several years when I wanted to try growing some hostas from seed just to see what I'd get. lol! Here are two of the 'seedlings' that I kept from what I grew. They're coming up late, but you can see that they look just like their mom:


So... assuming that it is a bunch of mature seedlings mixed in, what would you do with it?! Dig it up and divide out each eye? give up on it entirely? I really do like that rippling. lol!

[HostaDesigner]

I don't think this is a seedling mixed in. I assume the leaves are very thick, rough and leathery? I have been trying to figure out this problem for years. I've been told it was frost damage, or ice crystals injuring the eyes in the ground, but if so, why does it take several years (if ever) to recover? I have see this on many plants including S&S, Elegans, June, and Gold Drop to name a few. I'll see if I can dig up some pics of the ones I have seen in the past...

[party_music50]

I've just checked it all out carefully. Every eye in the original clump is doing whatever it's doing. The smaller leaves that appear as "normal" looking elegans are just small leaves at the base of each eye. The substance on the large rippled leaves is amazing... They are *extremely* thick and heavy, and the ridging on the underside is very pronounced and rough. I then checked the texture on the division that was taken years ago and it isn't nearly as substantial. hmmm...

hostadesigner, it could very well be caused by damage from a freeze. We had at least 3 nights in the mid 20s after the eyes were barely exposed. Are you saying that freeze damage causes the heavy and rough texture? and then what? I had several hostas that were severely damaged by the freezes/frosts, and some immediately sent up flower spikes (they look awful! no leaves, just a flowerspike. lol!), some are flushing out new leaves, and some are sitting there looking like mushed former leaves.

[HostaDesigner]

I've been told it's from freeze damage, but I'm not totally convinced. If so, why does it take so long to recover, if ever? Be prepared for your 'Elegans' to look like this, or at least have several eyes to look like this, for some years to come.

I had it happen to my 'June' back in 2006. It finally looks normal this year, 4 years later, with only minimal signs of this weird leather growth. I have seen a 'Titanic' and 'Frances Williams' killed from this. Huge and beautiful, then the next year it is reduced to a this with total loss of vigor.

Pics of my 'June' back in spring of 2006:

Very narrow wavy leaves, lighter color, unusual growth pattern


VERY leathery leaves. It's like all of the substance of a larger normal leaf is crammed into this ugly, narrow rough leaf.


Very pronounced veins feeling almost like sandpaper.

[Kas]

I have had this problem before and am having it with a vengence this year. I am convinced it is from heat stress in the previous year. The ones that have had this happen to them have recovered in one to two seasons of heavy and regular watering. I could kick myself because in my first years with hostas I was given a beautiful big blue (unknown, but didn't look like Elegans) and it came up like this it's second year with me. I freaked out and thought it was sick, so I tossed it. The next year I had some more do it and decided to pamper them with more water. Problem solved. At least in the next year or two, that is! We had such a hot summer here last year and I was gone to be with my mom during my dad's sickness and death. My poor hubby was home with the kids most of that time and only watered once. And as if that wasn't bad enough, the week he was at my mom's with the kids for the funeral was the hottest on record for the Seattle area and my plants didn't get watered at all during those 100 degree-plus days. So I lost lots of things and have about seven or eight leathery hostas.

And yes, I think since root competition will cause a hosta to not get all the water it would prefer, root competition can cause this weird leathery leaf problem.

Kas

[party_music50]

hostadesigner, thanks for posting the pics. The physical characteristics of your odd June are the same as what's happened to my elegans, although I wouldn't call it ugly. I wouldn't mind if it stayed like this because it's a nice change and the other (division) is just fine.

Maybe I shouldn't suggest this, but has anyone considered whether it might be some unknown virus that causes it?! hostadesigner indicated that some hostas exhibiting these characteristics dwindled and died. If it's speculated to be associated with freeze damage, or drought (as in Kas' case), then it could conceivably be a virus that manifests itself because the plant is stressed.

[Kas]

I doubt it is a virus simply because in the midst of my panic, I sent leaves to Dr. Lockhart. He couldn't find any virus present of any kind. I was relieved, but still freaked!

Kas

[Chris_W]

That sure is some freaky growth then! The only other time I've seen "odd" looking growth on hostas that took a couple years to come out of it was when we had some plants that were accidentally treated with 2-4-D, the chemical in weed-n-feed. Brian was using a whirlybird spreader to treat grass that was right near the hostas and the overspray caused lots of twisted growth on the scapes and stems for a couple summers. Leaves were also extra thick. After the hormone wore off the plants were back to normal.

But these look too perfect to be from 2-4-D, so I won't even try to speculate on what actually caused it!

And no, viruses would be highly unlikely to cause anything like this.

[party_music50]

Chemicals definitely didn't cause the change in my hosta, Chris -- I don't use them and neither do the neighbors.

Now I'll just wait and see what happens with this old elegans.... I'll give an update if anything changes.

Thanks everyone.

[eastwood2007]

Aliens...

Take it from me, you're never the same once they return you...

[jobranch]

My Elegans came back very different this year due to voles attacking it last year. I am not suggesting that you have had voles, only that it is hard for me to even call my Elegans - Elegans. As a matter of a fact, I have given it a new name. When it comes back looking like Elegans should, I'll swap names.

[thy]

A sieboldiana somehow sporting or changing in some way to look like a montana with a nice ripling
I dom't get it

[party_music50]

Hello everyone. It took me awhile to find this OLD post, but I wanted to report that my Elegans is back to looking normal! I remembered the leaves being far too small and narrow last year, but had completely forgotten about the rippled leaves in 2010. I think the odd growth must have been due to drought conditions for a couple of years. This year we're getting plenty of rain after having an extremely mild winter and the plant looks happy again.

[Noreaster]

I've got something similar happening to Blue Hawaii this year. The eyes were so thick this year, I expected huge, luscious leaves. Instead it's got narrow, thick, twisted ones on tall stalks. Looks odd, and not in a good way. I've got it in an agroliner bag, so one thing I can rule out is root competition. I was thinking I should maybe get it out of that bag and just let it grow in the ground. I am bummed to hear it takes a few years to get back to normal.