Deer question

[Tigger]

Maybe this belongs in another forum, but y'all are the people who care the most.

Can anyone offer a learned opinion: what effect does landscape lighting have on deer browsing? I.e. if I put a single light fixture next to the beds (2 or 3) in the woods, will deer be more attracted, less attracted, or attracted about the same to the delectables planted therein? (don't worry, I plan on keeping up with repellent sprays)

We had an outfit (Nature Technologies) out last week promoting their new sonic deer repellent system: these space-ship type speakers emit a "white noise" of sorts (the frequencies constantly changing) that confuse deer hearing; deer will supposedly stay away from places where the sound confuses their delicate hearing (i.e. warning system). They also require a contract to maintain the speakers and spray your plants, which is where they make their money! It was $1500 to install 5 speakers (much cheaper than fencing) but $129/mo for the service contract, year-round! Yikes!

At least I got a gift certificate to a good nursery for listening to the spiel. A friend of mine has already had the system installed, and I'll be interested to see how she fares.

[playinmud]

Here in NJ lights on/off has no affect. I can walk up to one within 5 feet and it just stares at me with those wide eyes. I literally have to show aggression to make them leave my property.

I'm looking forward to hearing about this system...maybe it works on squirrels too? But would hate to deter birds, they eat all the bugs.

[Tigger]

Their website is the obvious one. They say it has no effect on birds or housepets.

[newtohosta-no more]

Wow...that seems rather steep to me!! $129/mo!! Holy cow.....seems like in another year or so you could spend all that money on a nice fence instead and then have no monthly service fee. You'll have to ask the person who had it installed how it works out this year. I guess if deer are a serious problem in your area and your gardens are expansive ,then it might be worth it. Please let us know if it really seems to work.

[poppi]

Ouch!! Have you tried Liquid Fence? It's cheaper and it seems to work pretty well. I was told that you don't even need to mix it as strong as recommended for it to work. I have also heard that if you mix Wilt Proof with the liquid fence, it stays on much longer. Just a thought.

[Tigger]

Don't worry about my pocketbook; I'm not planning to install this this year! But long-term it does have its advantages. Probably the worst problem we have with deer is how they browse the growing tips of all the deciduous shrubs (hydrangea, azaleas, etc.), nipping off (frequently) all the flower buds. Deciduous shrubs are hard to treat effectively with deterrent sprays: how do you spray a stick? In some places I put up temporary fencing (just for winter), but that gets old fast and would be pretty impractical for the new shrub bed I put in last year. For the hostas and lilies (day- and otherwise), the sprays work if I keep with it.

[eastwood2007]

I have heard that Milorganite fertilizer will deter deer and rabbits...I use Milorganite, but the dogs keep everything away so I don't know if it works....

[thehostagourmet]

Poppi, I tried Liquid Fence last summer. The label says to make a second application after SEVEN days. I applied it on Hostas in my back border which faces the back yards of our rear neighbors. The stuff is pretty expensive too. We're in the suburbs on a 1/2 acre. I had hybridized my 'Yellow Highness' on two scapes with the Tyvek tags I use. On the SIXTH night the deer ate the scapes, Tyvek tags and all! I was furious. On others they ate many of the leaves. They seem to discriminate by color.

Shoot Bambi!!

George

[playinmud]

George I take a dozen eggs, pulse them in the blender until they're all liquified, add cayenne pepper and a few drops of liquid dish detergent (helps it stick to the plants), pour into a spray bottle and spray my plants/shrubs. The deer hate the smell of eggs, the pepper is nasty if they dare take a bite. This is organic, non-toxic, cheaper than liquid fence and not too difficult to prepare.

Make up a batch and try it on a hosta you don't care about as much as others...use it as a test. See if it works as well for you as it does for me. I have to admit though, on a hot day, it can smell nasty. But then again, Liquid Fence can be awful too.

[MollyD]

Tigger,

I asked my hunter BF and he says the lights won't have any effect on the deer and they'll get use to the sounds. Sounds like you'd better save up for a fence. Have you considered an electric fence? Less expensive than the more traditional ones.

MollyD

[Bill Meyer]

Hi Tigger,

From what I know about deer, I think this high-priced solution will work temporarily, then fail at some point. Most things that rely on smells, tastes, noises, etc. only work until the deer learn they are harmless. How long this takes is different in each case. They usually travel in small groups of a male and a harem of females. What usually happens is that one of the lower-ranked females gets sent in to test the defenses and if it gets food and survives they all come in. If they are getting enough food otherwise they might not bother, or if they haven't sampled hostas yet, but once they start feeding in a garden they will return for more.

The best solution, I think, is dogs. Ones with herding instincts would be best. They are always on the alert and always willing for a good chase. Their innate desire to herd is a perfect compliment to the fear deer have of being chased by predators like wolves. For us, that's a match made in heaven.

If you don't want to have dogs or a fence, your best bet is to vary your methods to keep the deer off guard. Different sprays, predator urine, etc. Whenever they get accustomed to one and learn to ignore it, change to a different one. The problem is that they are fairly intelligent and spend most of their waking hours thinking about food or eating it.

One thing you might have some success with if I remember your property well enough is to make an "invisible" fence by connecting strong clear fishing line between trees at varying heights. They'll feel it but have trouble seeing it and will be really nervous about trying to jump it. If you think about it, one thing they really fear is a broken leg, so they will be careful about jumping something they can't see. They'll try going under, so put some low to stop that. You could rig up a lightweight gate for the driveway. Don't circle the trees with it, or you may girdle them - attach it with nails or such.

If you're mixing up some homemade repellent, try using some pure capsaicin, which is sold as "Pure Cap" or similar. That will really give them a surprise. If you've ever tasted habanero or scotch bonnet peppers, imagine what the pure stuff will do It makes good revenge if nothing else.

............Bill Meyer

[twoblackdogs]

Hi Tigger,

Don't know if this will work for you or not, but thought I would share. My mother lives on the edge of one of our local universities biological stations - fields, woods, swamp etc - there are a ton of deer (bucks which make my hunter DH drool!) She uses Liquid Fence on her flower boxes on the deck which works well for her geraniums etc. For her perennial gardens she lays down green chicken wire flat in front of the bed, lifting it up when they mow. The chicken wire is the larger mesh size squares. To the casual observer, you can't see the chicken wire in the grass. The deer don't seem to like stepping on the chicken wire and leave those beds alone. She's done this for a number of years and had good success.

For my 250+ hosta, I alternate between Liquid Fence, fox urine and my dogs. My dogs only get to encourage the deer to move on during the summer - otherwise they just watch from inside during the winter. Oh, and a pellet gun bb to their rumps helps them move too -

Good luck!!

[renaldo75]

I have no idea if this really works or not. I ran across it last summer.

http://wirelessdeerfence.com/wdf/index.html

[Tigger]

Interesting idea. But this is buried in their information:

As a general rule, the Wireless Deer Fence posts should be placed between 5 and 25+ feet apart.

At $60 for a set of 3 posts… (and $7 for scent refills per set of 3)… it seems affordable. But do I want 15–21 of these things scattered around my property? Ugh.

[renaldo75]

True. I'd just saved the site & hadn't looked at it for a while. If it worked though, it would be a really good solution for a driveway if the rest of the area had deer fence.